Comments on: Modern Malandragem – or: should we take lessons from thugs? http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/2008/03/10/modern-malandragem-or-should-we-take-an-example-from-thugs/ Mon, 09 Nov 2009 13:07:13 +0000 http://wordpress.com/ hourly 1 By: dadadoll http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/2008/03/10/modern-malandragem-or-should-we-take-an-example-from-thugs/#comment-546 dadadoll Sat, 22 Aug 2009 01:24:53 +0000 http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/?p=18#comment-546 Im a noob capoeirista and i find your blogs very interesting, informative, and inspiring. Muito Obrigado! :) Im a noob capoeirista and i find your blogs very interesting, informative, and inspiring. Muito Obrigado! :)

]]> By: angoleiro http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/2008/03/10/modern-malandragem-or-should-we-take-an-example-from-thugs/#comment-95 angoleiro Thu, 03 Jul 2008 18:24:50 +0000 http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/?p=18#comment-95 Hoi Pirulito, thanks for your comment! I am glad about every kind of response to my posts here, especially the ones which tell me that the posts are great ;)! isnt your name "Lollipop"? great name! yeah I am living in the netherlands and I just saw the flyer from the workshop in september. looks quite interesting! well, gotta see if I am able to come around. Axé! Hoi Pirulito, thanks for your comment! I am glad about every kind of response to my posts here, especially the ones which tell me that the posts are great ;) ! isnt your name “Lollipop”? great name! yeah I am living in the netherlands and I just saw the flyer from the workshop in september. looks quite interesting! well, gotta see if I am able to come around.

Axé!

]]> By: pirulito http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/2008/03/10/modern-malandragem-or-should-we-take-an-example-from-thugs/#comment-94 pirulito Thu, 03 Jul 2008 13:28:13 +0000 http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/?p=18#comment-94 Hello angoleiro, your posts are great. I enjoy reading them and i read ´em all, thank you! Valeu mesmo!!! If i understood you right, you do live in the netherlands. I live in Hamburg, when you pass by northern Germany, come on over some time! Maybe in September... falou, pirulito Hello angoleiro,

your posts are great. I enjoy reading them and i read ´em all, thank you! Valeu mesmo!!!

If i understood you right, you do live in the netherlands. I live in Hamburg, when you pass by northern Germany, come on over some time! Maybe in September…
falou, pirulito

]]> By: Revenge in Capoeira « Angoleiro’s Blog http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/2008/03/10/modern-malandragem-or-should-we-take-an-example-from-thugs/#comment-91 Revenge in Capoeira « Angoleiro’s Blog Wed, 25 Jun 2008 15:43:36 +0000 http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/?p=18#comment-91 [...] about was Do I survive or not? and that did include some unfair measures. This did include some malandragem. Capoeira grew in these times and learned a lot about life. Capoeira is the philosophy of the small [...] [...] about was Do I survive or not? and that did include some unfair measures. This did include some malandragem. Capoeira grew in these times and learned a lot about life. Capoeira is the philosophy of the small [...]

]]> By: angoleiro http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/2008/03/10/modern-malandragem-or-should-we-take-an-example-from-thugs/#comment-38 angoleiro Mon, 17 Mar 2008 17:51:52 +0000 http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/?p=18#comment-38 we definitely had a lot of fun, especially in the rodas where malicia was kind of important! we definitely had a lot of fun, especially in the rodas where malicia was kind of important!

]]> By: Joaninha http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/2008/03/10/modern-malandragem-or-should-we-take-an-example-from-thugs/#comment-37 Joaninha Mon, 17 Mar 2008 15:58:04 +0000 http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/?p=18#comment-37 Hahaha you have some great stories! You and your teachers must have a lot of fun in class/in the roda =D Hahaha you have some great stories! You and your teachers must have a lot of fun in class/in the roda =D

]]> By: angoleiro http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/2008/03/10/modern-malandragem-or-should-we-take-an-example-from-thugs/#comment-36 angoleiro Mon, 17 Mar 2008 10:13:17 +0000 http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/?p=18#comment-36 yup...people do think a lot of times that capoeira is quite harmless because 80% of all the movements are not applicable when you are in a man-to-man fight somewhere on the streets. and they are right, yeah, but nobody said that a Capoeirista does do the same in the street! A real Capoeirista does not feel ashamed when he beggs for his life one day just to get out of the situation. A real Capoeirista does not favor a situation where the chances are high that he might get beaten up...so he uses EVERY possibility. A couple of other examples: During training I learned a certain movement (and a lot of Angoleiros do know this movement) which looks kind of silly when you are playing in an academy but does make a lot of sense on the streets. This movement is bowing down, grapping a handful of sand and throwing it into the face of the other person. In the training you usually dont have sand lying around so you do this movement "dry", so it might look silly, but everybody knows how painful sand can be in your eyes. Another story. My plays with my first teacher were always quite rough, that was because he knew I would not take things personally and he knew I was able to defend myself (not always of course and he more than once took me down or kicked me out of the roda). In one of those games he took of his hat, threw it at me and I instinctively ducked away from it. In that second I realized that that was just a finta and I wanted to prepare myself but in that moment I was already flying out of the roda, cause my trainer jumped in with a full fleshed chapa. Well, at least I was laughing on my way out of the roda... ;) yup…people do think a lot of times that capoeira is quite harmless because 80% of all the movements are not applicable when you are in a man-to-man fight somewhere on the streets. and they are right, yeah, but nobody said that a Capoeirista does do the same in the street! A real Capoeirista does not feel ashamed when he beggs for his life one day just to get out of the situation. A real Capoeirista does not favor a situation where the chances are high that he might get beaten up…so he uses EVERY possibility.
A couple of other examples:
During training I learned a certain movement (and a lot of Angoleiros do know this movement) which looks kind of silly when you are playing in an academy but does make a lot of sense on the streets. This movement is bowing down, grapping a handful of sand and throwing it into the face of the other person. In the training you usually dont have sand lying around so you do this movement “dry”, so it might look silly, but everybody knows how painful sand can be in your eyes.
Another story. My plays with my first teacher were always quite rough, that was because he knew I would not take things personally and he knew I was able to defend myself (not always of course and he more than once took me down or kicked me out of the roda). In one of those games he took of his hat, threw it at me and I instinctively ducked away from it. In that second I realized that that was just a finta and I wanted to prepare myself but in that moment I was already flying out of the roda, cause my trainer jumped in with a full fleshed chapa. Well, at least I was laughing on my way out of the roda… ;)

]]> By: Joaninha http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/2008/03/10/modern-malandragem-or-should-we-take-an-example-from-thugs/#comment-35 Joaninha Sun, 16 Mar 2008 21:46:04 +0000 http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/?p=18#comment-35 Touché, you two! ==> From Greg Downey's <i>Learning Capoeira</i>: In capoeira stories, one finds few heroic stands against impossible odds, no tales akin to the Seven Samurai or the Alamo. Far from it. One veteran capoeirista told me a legend she had heard about Besouro Manganga that, for her, captured the lesson of malicia. She recounted how, when surrounded by a squadron of police, Besouro fell to the ground and cried like a baby. ... The police were stupefied upon finding the notorious thug curled up on the ground sobbing shamelessly, begging them not to hurt him. ... Mestre Joao Grande had once told her that "the first weapon of a capoeirista is to disarm" an adversary. Or, as Mestre Pastinha reportedly said: "A capoeirista has an obligation to cry at the foot of his adversary." Mestre Moraes added that capoeira taught one to use whatever trick was necessary to gain an advantage, regardless of one's pride or moral reservations. In addition to skills, a lack of concern for social norms or honour, according to Moraes, made a capoeirista especially dangerous and unpredicable. Touché, you two! ==>

From Greg Downey’s Learning Capoeira:

In capoeira stories, one finds few heroic stands against impossible odds, no tales akin to the Seven Samurai or the Alamo. Far from it. One veteran capoeirista told me a legend she had heard about Besouro Manganga that, for her, captured the lesson of malicia. She recounted how, when surrounded by a squadron of police, Besouro fell to the ground and cried like a baby. … The police were stupefied upon finding the notorious thug curled up on the ground sobbing shamelessly, begging them not to hurt him. … Mestre Joao Grande had once told her that “the first weapon of a capoeirista is to disarm” an adversary. Or, as Mestre Pastinha reportedly said: “A capoeirista has an obligation to cry at the foot of his adversary.” Mestre Moraes added that capoeira taught one to use whatever trick was necessary to gain an advantage, regardless of one’s pride or moral reservations. In addition to skills, a lack of concern for social norms or honour, according to Moraes, made a capoeirista especially dangerous and unpredicable.

]]> By: Joaninha http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/2008/03/10/modern-malandragem-or-should-we-take-an-example-from-thugs/#comment-33 Joaninha Fri, 14 Mar 2008 20:35:40 +0000 http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/?p=18#comment-33 It's funny/coincidental that you guys have started a discussion on how you fend off trouble in the streets here, because there was an exact parallel one going on for women, on my blog! (The post is called "Walking Home", if you're interested.) And thanks for that caveat Akira; I really was reading and taking in what you said as advice, kind of! Thanks for replying to my first comment Angoleiro =D Yeah I pretty much agree with everything you said...one thing though, I find it so funny that you said cunning and wit aren't "classic" hero traits, because I don't know if you've read The Odyssey, but Odysseus was *known* <i>precisely</i> for his cunning and wit, and he's as Classic[al] as you could get! (Pun intended, heh :P) Also, I didn't know that about malandros...I thought the point of being a malandro was that you're NOT a common thug but actually a street-smart guy by definition, someone who knows how to get the most benefit from the least work possible, who has finesse and knows how to use it...? I like the point about capoeira being about evading though, that's true, and something I forgot! It’s funny/coincidental that you guys have started a discussion on how you fend off trouble in the streets here, because there was an exact parallel one going on for women, on my blog! (The post is called “Walking Home”, if you’re interested.)

And thanks for that caveat Akira; I really was reading and taking in what you said as advice, kind of!

Thanks for replying to my first comment Angoleiro =D Yeah I pretty much agree with everything you said…one thing though, I find it so funny that you said cunning and wit aren’t “classic” hero traits, because I don’t know if you’ve read The Odyssey, but Odysseus was *known* precisely for his cunning and wit, and he’s as Classic[al] as you could get! (Pun intended, heh :P )

Also, I didn’t know that about malandros…I thought the point of being a malandro was that you’re NOT a common thug but actually a street-smart guy by definition, someone who knows how to get the most benefit from the least work possible, who has finesse and knows how to use it…? I like the point about capoeira being about evading though, that’s true, and something I forgot!

]]> By: akira87 http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/2008/03/10/modern-malandragem-or-should-we-take-an-example-from-thugs/#comment-32 akira87 Fri, 14 Mar 2008 18:54:50 +0000 http://angoleiro.wordpress.com/?p=18#comment-32 Hehe yeah, being dark and mysterious would help with the intimidation factor. Also, let me add this for anyone who read my comments: if you live in a major city or some place famed for gun and knife fights, do NOT attempt to do what I do. I'm currently in a small place where the majority of troublemakers are either in their late teens or incredibly stupid. If you piss off the wrong gangster or even a crazy person with a weapon, that'll be your last mistake... Hehe yeah, being dark and mysterious would help with the intimidation factor.

Also, let me add this for anyone who read my comments: if you live in a major city or some place famed for gun and knife fights, do NOT attempt to do what I do. I’m currently in a small place where the majority of troublemakers are either in their late teens or incredibly stupid. If you piss off the wrong gangster or even a crazy person with a weapon, that’ll be your last mistake…

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